Black Betty no start

[Turbogus]

Hi Gang it's been a long time. Over the last year and a half 'Black Betty' has been giving me fits with the Ignition system. (1978 CJ5 w/360) I've installed a new Primary Battery (I have a 2nd one for my winch) and I've tried replacing the Starter Solenoid

and checking the wiring from it to the E-Coil

yes I'm most of the way to the Team Rush upgrade.

Since the mods necessary for the Team Rush upgrade I've gone as far as I can save for the Ignition MSD Module box and she was running fine until last year. The distributor has not been altered and the starter spins the motor up fine. I've taken the steps in the DARS chart in the official Jeep TSM and I'm at a loss on how to proceed. If there's any electrical gurus here, please chime in. Thanks and a lift of the lynch lid.
Gus

 

[TerryMason]

Is it just cranking but not starting?
Are you sure that it's ignition, and not something else like fuel? Maybe throw alittle gas or starting fluid down the carb?

If you've done all this work, it may be worth the time to verify your firing order, and the condition of your battery terminals.

 

[Turbogus]

When I rotate the throttle lever there's fuel coming out of the Accelerator Pump nozzles and when I take it too far there's fuel coming out of the Bowl Vent Tube

 

[Turbogus]

After running through the DARS chart in the TSM I seem to be grasping at straws. On another forum one Jeeper had a similar issue and traced it to the ignition switch itself. Many years ago I found mine increasingly harder to turn. I took it apart only to find that a PO had inserted a wood screw into the cylinder after removing it the cylinder behaved normally and easy to turn. Perhaps I should take a closer look to see if it needs replacing.

 

[superj]

When I rotate the throttle lever there's fuel coming out of the Accelerator Pump nozzles and when I take it too far there's fuel coming out of the Bowl Vent Tube

The bowl vent tube spilling fuel is probably something for you to return to look at once you get the jeep running again since the bowl float should prevent the bowl from filling enough to come out the vent tube. Something is not operating correctly in there for that to happen. All it will cause is a slight rich setting when flooring it though, as long as it only does it a little and doesnt keep dribbling fuel out if you hold the throttle open

 

[Turbogus]

I'm hip Samuel, this state is only when I take it beyond my normal startup. Last year one blip of the throttle to set the choke and she took off.

 

[Turbogus]

Knulla she won't turn over at all now.

edit Vittu Minua, I forgot to ground the Starter Relay

 

[Turbogus]

Okay I grounded the Starter Solenoid and she spun up just fine. I removed the Cap to the MSD and watched the Rotor make several turns without pause. That's a relief. I'm going to try checking out the under dash connection panel and the Key Cylinder next once it cools down. 101 today.

 

[TerryMason]

That's great man. I'm glad that you are pointed in the right direction.

 

[Turbogus]

Thank Terry, I'm being criticized on another forum where a couple of kind folks insist this is a fuel issue. With the double whammy of the low voltage from the Starter Solenoid and the open from the Coil to the 13B Terminal of the Dash Connector I'm convinced that this is electrical.

 

[Turbogus]

Today while I was out to Physical Therapy I stopped by NAPA looking for a Fuel Primer Bottle. Heretofore, I was pouring old fuel into a carb cleaner lid and clumsily adding fuel to the primaries. At NAPA all they had was an oversized Battery Filler so I figured if it's impervious to battery acid it should be okay for fuel. In a little while I'm heading over to VP fuels to pick up a gallon of 110 Tetraethyllead Gasoline and in the coming days I'm back to work so the trial of squirting fuel down the primaries of the AFB will have to wait. This step is at the insistence of some on the other forum.

 

[TerryMason]

I have no idea if it's good or not, but all the guys on youtube seem to use bottles like this to add fuel:

Amazon.com: Allstar Performance 16.9 oz. Primer Bottle (ALL40090) : Automotive

Buy Allstar Performance 16.9 oz. Primer Bottle (ALL40090): Fuel Additives - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

If you're serious, you could try something like this:

Amazon.com: MOTO4U 500ml Motorcycle Auxiliary Fuel Tank with Cut-Off Valve & Vent – Universal Gas Tank for Carburetor Tuning, Small Engine Repair, Carb Sync (Fits Bikes, Mowers, Cars) : Automotive

Buy MOTO4U 500ml Motorcycle Auxiliary Fuel Tank with Cut-Off Valve & Vent – Universal Gas Tank for Carburetor Tuning, Small Engine Repair, Carb Sync (Fits Bikes, Mowers, Cars): Gas Tanks - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

The second one may leave your hands free to do other things.

 

[Turbogus]

Thanks Terry! Yep, something like that was what I was looking for but I got impatient.
Mustie 1 has the one I was looking for
https://www.youtube.com/@mustie1

 

[Turbogus]

As a sidebar, I'm still running the Ford EEC-1 Ignition Control Module that was stock on 'Black Betty'

 

[Turbogus]

I was checking the Air Screws and what do you know, some gremlin

maladjusted them. On the primary side it was nearly at its stop. Going to adjust the Floats again and take it from the top.

 

[Turbogus]

Okay gang, by now I think I may have it narrowed down to a goof I made in setting up the floats. Long ago I took the fractional data for setting the floats and float drop to decimal so I could use my calipers. I think I may have misinterpreted the calculation or just took a false reading. The last time I tried to start I noticed excess fuel from the top Metering Rod Covers, indicating a poor float setting or, Heaven forbid an internal blockage. Here's hoping I'm on the right track now.

 

[Turbogus]

Is it just cranking but not starting?
Are you sure that it's ignition, and not something else like fuel? Maybe throw alittle gas or starting fluid down the carb?

If you've done all this work, it may be worth the time to verify your firing order, and the condition of your battery terminals.

Yep, that's just what it's doing. I've clumsily ran a bit of fuel down the carb and it seems that I may be dealing with maladjusted floats.

 

[Turbogus]

The bowl vent tube spilling fuel is probably something for you to return to look at once you get the jeep running again since the bowl float should prevent the bowl from filling enough to come out the vent tube. Something is not operating correctly in there for that to happen. All it will cause is a slight rich setting when flooring it though, as long as it only does it a little and doesnt keep dribbling fuel out if you hold the throttle open

Yep that's just where I'm leaning too. Thanks

 

[Turbogus]

I may have been a little rough handed when I last adjusted the floats and I understand that it takes more finesse than that. I hope to get to it in the coming days.

 

[Turbogus]

What do ruptured pipes have to do with a Carter AFB?