Any Masons on Jeepz?

[KrazyJeeper]

I was watching a TV show about the freemasons the other night and it intrigued me so I was wondering if we have any traveling men on here.

 

[mud4feet]

............ so I was wondering if we have any traveling men on here.

Well, I'm not a freemason, but I've done some traveling............I believe we're refered to as "construction gypsies". If you build bridges, you gotta go where the rivers are!!

 

[90Xjay]

I was watching a TV show about the freemasons the other night and it intrigued me so I was wondering if we have any traveling men on here.

it's hard to do "the" handshake over the internet

 

[TwistedCU]

I know that there are. I am not one but had an interesting PM session with someone who is. I'm not sure that it is something someone states openly or not so don't be offended if they remain anonymous.

I saw that show also.

 

[mingez]

Ya, they're not supposed to divulge that openly.

 

[Bounty__Hunter]

I saw that show on the listing, but didn't catch it. What's it about?

 

[Gone&DoneIt]

I am a Freemason. I saw the same program on discovery I believe,... about Jack the Ripper and the new world order?

I was never taught not to disclose my affiliation, its just that most people have a preposterous idea of what Freemasonry is all about and therein most Masons have decided to conceal their affiliation to harbor them from various types of discrimination. I even have a large Masonic tattoo. http://www.masonicink.com/jackgarret/index.html
I am proud of my committment, and what it stands for so I show it off (besides,... it looks really cool...). But in the defense of those who keep their beliefs private, I have been called a satanist, a bigot, a racist, a propagator of the new world order, a natzi... I've heard it all.



I am more than happy to answer any and all questions about the order, to the best of my ability, both openly and honesly. I figure after that program a lot of people are probably curious. Alot of the secrecy is designed to create just that- curiosity, which then creates membership. Unfortunately, as history dictates, what people don't understand they fear... the secrecy also lends itself to a whole host of conspiracy theories and conjecture, some good, some bad.... it's human nature I guess.

 

[firemanharry]

I am a Freemason - Pyramid #92 in NJ

 

[currupt4130]

So my biggest question for you two. What exactly is a free mason and what do they do? I missed the show.

 

[mingez]

I am a Freemason. I saw the same program on discovery I believe,... about Jack the Ripper and the new world order?

I was never taught not that to disclose my affiliation, its just that most people have a preposterous idea of what Freemasonry is all about and therein most Masons have decided to conceal their affiliation to harbor them from various types of discrimination. I even have a large Masonic tattoo. http://www.masonicink.com/jackgarret/index.html
I am proud of my committment, and what it stands for so I show it off (besides,... it looks really cool...). But in the defense of those who keep their beliefs private, I have been called a satanist, a bigot, a racist, a propagator of the new world order, a natzi... I've heard it all.


I am more than happy to answer any and all questions about the order, to the best of my ability, both openly and honesly. I figure after that program a lot of people are probably curious. Alot of the secrecy is designed to create just that- curiosity, which then creates membership. Unfortunately, as history dictates, what people don't understand they fear... the secrecy also lends itself to a whole host of conspiracy theories and conjecture, some good, some bad.... it's human nature I guess.

Those are some sweet tats. I thought you weren't necessarily supposed to go out of your way to talk about customs etc?

My belief that you all weren't really supposed to come out and divulge your membership came from one of my best friend's husband, who seems very uncomfortable with questions toward the Masons. Not to mention, he never spoke of it. So I apologize for my mistake there. Perhaps he was so unwilling to talk about it because of the discrimination you spoke of.

So question one: why the secrecy? I get a lot of mixed messages from people. Here, you a very forth coming about your society, but then you admit that there is an amount of secrecy which leads to conjecture. Can you clarify that? Because my limited experience with the society is that they aren't always as open as you.

Thanks. I find the history behind the Masons incredibly fascinating.

 

[Gone&DoneIt]

I am a Freemason - Pyramid #92 in NJ

St. Johns Lodge No. 1 Providence R.I.

Nice to meet you.

Jack

 

[Gone&DoneIt]

So my biggest question for you two. What exactly is a free mason and what do they do? I missed the show.

Those are some sweet tats. I thought you weren't necessarily supposed to go out of your way to talk about customs etc?

My belief that you all weren't really supposed to come out and divulge your membership came from one of my best friend's husband, who seems very uncomfortable with questions toward the Masons. Not to mention, he never spoke of it. So I apologize for my mistake there. Perhaps he was so unwilling to talk about it because of the discrimination you spoke of.

So question one: why the secrecy? I get a lot of mixed messages from people. Here, you a very forth coming about your society, but then you admit that there is an amount of secrecy which leads to conjecture. Can you clarify that? Because my limited experience with the society is that they aren't always as open as you.

Thanks. I find the history behind the Masons incredibly fascinating.

It's a fraternity basically, and a philanthropic organization rolled into one. We donate almost 2million dollars a day to charities. THe Shrine Burn Hospital is operated by Masons. God forbid a child is severly burned, they can be treated at one of the leading burn hospitals in the world with no out of pocket costs to the family if they cannot afford it.

We raise money,... lots of money,... to help those in need.

I can probably better answer what it is, by answering what it isn't:

It isn't a church, it isn't a religeous organization, it isn't a political movement or sub-party, and contrary to popular belief, we didn't stalk prostitutes in london, murder Captain Morgan, or institute slavery in the US.

We did organize the Boston Tea Party, co-author the constitution and bill of rights (most of them at least) and helped institute a new system of government based on freedom from oppression and equality of all people in the U.S.

We were one of the first groups targeted for extermination by Hitler in Germany, and we are banned from openly existing in the majority of dictatorships around the world. The last thing a despot or tyrant wants is a group of men who believe all are equal including said leader, and teaching morality and civic responsibility to those being oppressed (you can see how well that worked out for the british in the 1600's...).

To me,... Masonry is what this country is supposed to be. What this country was founded on,... the embodiment of every mans search for enlightenment, and the underlying drive to be moral, honest, and responsible. As you commence this personal journey, you find people from all walks of life, walking along side you. I have made friendships that will last a lifetime, and had the incredible opportunity to make a lifetimes worth of difference in several peoples lives who were in need, all because of my affiliation with Freemasonry.

The secrecy, is a double edged sword. Have you ever walked by a construction project on a busy street like the strip? Oftentimes they will cover the fences with plywood to obscure the view of the public. Is it because they are hiding the missing floor joists they saved money on,... I guess it could be,... but more likely it is to stir peoples curiosity, intrigue them, get them interested before the unvailing. You can buy any one of a hundred books that openly discuss the goings on inside a masonic lodge. Some that even have the lectures we study and learn verbatim. I think the idea behind any closed society is to make it's members feel special, and make the considerable amount of work one puts into becoming a mason that much more valuable.

Those are purely my own thoughts and feelings. I am very open about my status as a Mason, because it is one of the things I am proudest of. I will gladly discuss the philosophies and ideals. I will not however break my obligations to my fellow Masons and myself. So ask away, just please don't be offended if I have to deflect a question here or there.

R. Jack Garrett

 

[mingez]

That's really cool, your charity as an organization.

People think you all are a church? That's a new one on me.

The only religious connotation I know of is the fact that a member must believe in a supreme being of some sort. Right?

For this reason, I could never even be considered.

What are some of the other criteria by which a member is chosen?

 

[TwistedCU]

They are a secret society who are responsible for everything from the Crusades to global warming.

Hahaha no seriously though... what little I do know makes me wish I had joined them years ago when I had the time to complete the process.

They seem to get blamed or get credit for just about anything and everything. It's like they're the "We don't know or understand how so blame the Freemasons" :roll:

I guess the people who set that blame don't know much about the Illuminati :lol:

 

[Gone&DoneIt]

That's really cool, your charity as an organization.

People think you all are a church? That's a new one on me.

The only religious connotation I know of is the fact that a member must believe in a supreme being of some sort. Right?

For this reason, I could never even be considered.

What are some of the other criteria by which a member is chosen?

People see the word "Temple" outside the building and WHAMMO you're a church. A few people have actually stated they thought we were the elite head of the Church of Scientology.

You have to pass a background check, not for tickets and the like, but to determine the sort of character of the candidate. That's what it boils down to.

They are a secret society who are responsible for everything from the Crusades to global warming.

Hahaha no seriously though... what little I do know makes me wish I had joined them years ago when I had the time to complete the process.

They seem to get blamed or get credit for just about anything and everything. It's like they're the "We don't know or understand how so blame the Freemasons" :roll:

I guess the people who set that blame don't know much about the Illuminati :lol:

Yes, actually, I have to confess, I was the third shooter on the grassy knoll....

it kills me some of the things freemasons have had "credited" to them...

I will tell you, al joking aside, Friday the 13th is considered unlucky because in 1307 it was the date the Roman Catholic Church had all freemasons exterminated simultaneously. They went from having unrivaled power, and authority under cannon law to travel the lands and search for something the church desperately wanted found, to being exterminated for (presumably) what they found and the potential impact it would have on the Church. Until very recently, you could be a Mason and a Catholic, but the Catholic church wouldn't allow their parishoners to be Masons. (Many people speculate they found the dead sea scrolls which more or less destroyed the churches claims of divinty and authority. Reportedly, the masons therein refused to detroy the documents as charged. The vessles the scrolls were found in back in the 60's had masonic emblems among others engraved on them.)



Anyway, that is the history behind Friday the 13th.

 

[Gone&DoneIt]

That's really cool, your charity as an organization.

People think you all are a church? That's a new one on me.

The only religious connotation I know of is the fact that a member must believe in a supreme being of some sort. Right?

For this reason, I could never even be considered.

What are some of the other criteria by which a member is chosen?

one other thing I forgot to mention. There is an insane amount of learning and memorization that goes into the process. A ton. I learned more in the 6 months I studied for the first degree in masonry than I did in entire semesters of college. It is incredably complex, but also enthralling.

 

[TwistedCU]

(Many people speculate they found the dead sea scrolls which more or less destroyed the churches claims of divinty and authority.

Are you referring to the divinity of Christ, or the Catholic Church's claim that the Pope has divinely-appointed authority over all the world church?

Sorry for my ignorance on that but I am very curious.

 

[Gone&DoneIt]

The dead sea scrolls are very much open to interpretation, but one thing they state emphatically is that no one can interceed between God and man. Thus impacting the Catholic Churches claim to fame more or less. (I mean no disrespect there.) The include the gospel of Jesus which is supposed to be written by Him in His own hand writing. The authenticity has been repeatedly verified confirming they are from the period of time they claim to be, and that the language and vocabulary is consitent with other documents authored by the claimed authors. These scrolls are believed to contain an entire host of documents that were excluded by the catholic church during the canonization process of the bible.

To back a bit, as Christianity spread througout the middle east specific centers were established. The were tasked with compiling and copying the letters and manuscripts written by prominent church figures and apostles. It is pretty comonly accepted that there were 27 various collections dispersed throughout these centers. As time went on, the 27 different documents (Bible books) would travel about and end up in different Christian churches or Christian centers. Each main Christian center would begin their own collection of these New Testament scriptures (ie.manuscripts) by making their copies. Some books might never get to another center. This would produce some question whether the book was authentic.

Most books were easily accepted, however the authenticity of a number was debated. Twenty of the twenty-seven books were clearly accepted by 180 A.D. Athanasius as the bishop of Alexandria listed the twenty-seven books in 367 A.D. The Chalcedon Council merely affirmed what had already been clearly established in 451 A.D.

As you probably know, Catholic Bibles have 73 books, 46 in the Old Testament, and 27 in the New Testament. Protestant Bibles have 66 books with only 39 in the Old Testament. The books missing from Protestant Bibles are: Tobit, Judith, Baruch, Wisdom, Sirach, 1 and 2 Maccabees, and parts of Esther and Daniel. They are called the 'Deuterocanonicals' by Catholics and 'Apocrypha' by Protestants. Martin Luther, without any authority whatsoever, removed those seven books and placed them in an appendix during the reformation. They remained in the appendix of Protestant Bibles until about 1826, and then they were removed altogether.

Many documents, letters, and manuscripts depicting the teachings of Christ, and his brother were excluded from the version of the Bible the catholic church accepted due to questions of their authenticity. It is undeniable, that if the dead sea scrolls are authentic, and were presented to the church for review, and indeed included rather than being rejected it would have changed the face of organized religion as we know it today.

This is a great link, it is the catholic explanation of the execution of the Knights Templars, where most accept Freemasonry has it's root. I am not sure what I believe, part of me thinks the explanation fits quite well, a very large group of Masons were in Turkey before they disbanded on thier own. The scrolls were found in Turkey. The existence of the scrolls would certainly be viewed as a threat by the church. From there it is up to personal faith, interpretation of history, and preferance. I want to point out that this is all Masonic lore, legend and history. It is not mandated or taught as fact by any Masonic Lodges I have been associated with.

Hope this helps...

 

[KrazyJeeper]

I knew a mason years back and just when I started getting interested, I PCS'd to Japan and really hadn't thought of it again until I watched the show. Six months huh? Man, that's a long time to prepare. So are you able to divulge what type of prospecting you have to do, ie; exams, memorization or what. I understand if you can't say. Also, how do you initiate becoming a member? Do you have to have someone sponsor you? Many questions here. I only mentioned the traveling man thing, because I had mentioned to another mason that he had a nice ring and he turned around and asked my if I was also a traveling man. Maybe I shouldn't have used the phrase since I am not for sure what he meant. Heck, not to make fun, but I always think back and wonder if that was some kind of secret password or way of telling another mason. Shoot me as much information that you can if you would, not saying that I would like to do it, but I would like to research it. Thanks, KJ

 

[Gone&DoneIt]

That's really cool, your charity as an organization.

People think you all are a church? That's a new one on me.

The only religious connotation I know of is the fact that a member must believe in a supreme being of some sort. Right?

For this reason, I could never even be considered.

What are some of the other criteria by which a member is chosen?

Freemasonry under totalitarian regimes
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(Redirected from Freemasonry under Totalitarian Regimes)
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Virtualy all totalitarian regimes have treated Freemasonry as a potential source of opposition due to its secret nature and international connections. It has been alleged by Masonic scholars that the language used by the totalitarian regimes is similar to that used by some modern critics of Freemasonry.[1]

Contents [hide]
1 Papal State
2 Hungary
3 Eastern Europe
4 Iraq
5 Italy
6 Spain
7 Japan
8 Other countries
9 Nazi Germany and Occupied Europe
10 Notes and references
11 See also
12 External links



[edit] Papal State
In 1736 the Florentine Inquisition investigated a Masonic Lodge in Florence, Italy,[2] and the Lodge was condemned in June 1737. The lodge had originally been founded by English Masons, but accepted Italian members.

In 1738, Pope Clement XII issued Eminenti Apostolatus Specula, the first Papal prohibition on Freemasonry.


[edit] Hungary
In 1919, Béla Kun proclaimed the dictatorship of the proletariat in Hungary. This marked the start of raids by army officers on Masonic lodges[1] along with theft, and sometimes destruction, of Masonic libraries, records, archives, paraphernalia, and works of art. Several Masonic buildings were seized and used for anti-Masonic exhibitions. Masonry was outlawed by a decree in 1920.

In post war Hungary, lodges were described as "meeting places of the enemies of the people's democratic republic, of capitalistic elements, and of the adherents of Western imperialism."[1]


[edit] Eastern Europe
Freemasonry was suppressed throughout Eastern Europe and the Soviet Union during the Communist era.


[edit] Iraq
Under Saddam Hussein the death penalty was "prescribed" for those who "promote or acclaim Zionist principles, including freemasonry, or who associate [themselves] with Zionist organizations."[3]


[edit] Italy
Benito Mussolini decreed in 1924 that every member of his Fascist Party who was a Mason must abandon either one or the other organization, and in 1925, he dissolved Freemasonry in Italy, claiming that it was a political organisation. It is worth noting that General Cappello, one of the most prominent Fascists, and who had also been Deputy Grand Master of the Grande Oriente, Italy's leading Grand Lodge, gave up his membership in the Fascist Party rather than in Masonry. He was later arrested on false charges and sentenced to 30 years in jail.[4]

However as the membership list of the elite P2 Masonic Lodge revealed in 1981 many Italian Fascists and Black Shirt Members later became Freemasons. The Grand Master of P2, Lucio Gelli, was an intelligence officer with the Herman Goering Division and a fervent Mussolini supporter.[5]


[edit] Spain
It is claimed that the dictator Miguel Primo de Rivera ordered the abolition of Freemasonry in Spain.[6] In September 1928, one of the two Grand Lodges in Spain was closed and many Masons were included among those arrested for allegedly plotting against the government.[citation needed]

Under the dictator General Francisco Franco, Freemasonry was outlawed in Spain on 2 March 1940.[2] Being a Mason was automatically punishable by a jail term: up to six years for those holding degrees up to the 18th, and more for Masons with higher degrees.[3] It was reported that Masons were shot, tortured and murdered in every town in Spain, although details are lacking.[4] The Republican Regime which Franco overthrew had a strong Masonic presence.[7]

The suppression of Freemasons in Spain continued into the 1970's.[1]


[edit] Japan
In 1938, a Japanese representative to the Weltdienst congress stated, on behalf of Japan, that "Judeo-Masonry is forcing the Chinese to turn China into a spearhead for an attack on Japan, and thereby forcing Japan to defend herself against this threat. Japan is at war not with China but with Freemasonry, represented by General Chiang-Kai-shek, the successor of his master, the Freemason Sun-Yat-Sen." [1]


[edit] Other countries
Freemasonry was persecuted in all the communist countries, but the organisation has survived in Cuba, allegedly providing safe haven for dissidents [5].


[edit] Nazi Germany and Occupied Europe
See also: Holocaust, Freemasonry, and Liberté chérie (Freemasonry)
The Nazis claimed that high degree Masons were willing members of "the Jewish conspiracy" and that Freemasonry was one of the causes of Germany's loss of the First World War. The preserved records of the RSHA - Reichssicherheitshauptamt Office of the High Command of Security Service pursuing the racial objectives of the SS through Race and Resettlement Office, show the persecution of the Freemasons.[8] The number of Freemasons from Nazi occupied countries who were killed is not accurately known,[9] but it is estimated that between 80,000 and 200,000 Freemasons were murdered under the Nazi regime.[10]

In Mein Kampf, Adolf Hitler writes that Freemasonry has "succumbed" to the Jews and has become an "excellent instrument" to fight for their aims and to use their "strings" to pull the upper strata of society into their alleged designs. He continues, "The general pacifistic paralysis of the national instinct of self-preservation begun by Freemasonry" is then transmitted to the masses of society by the press.[11]

In 1933 Hermann Goering; Reichstag President and one of the key figures in the process of Gleichschaltung, (literally synchronization), states "..in National Socialist Germany, there is no place for Freemasonry."[12]

The Enabling Act (Ermächtigungsgesetz in German) was passed by Germany's parliament (the Reichstag) on March 23, 1933. Using the "Act", on January 8, 1934 the German Ministry of the Interior ordered the disbandment of Freemasonry, and confiscation of the property of all Lodges; stating that those who had been members of Lodges when Hitler came to power, in January 1933, were prohibited from holding office in the Nazi party or its paramilitary arms, and were ineligible for appointment in public service.[13] Consistently considered an ideological foe of Nazism in their world perception (Weltauffassung), special sections of the Security Service (SD) and later the Reich Security Main Office (RSHA) were established to deal with the Freemasonry.[14] Freemasonic Concentration Camp inmates were graded as “Political” prisoners, and wore an inverted (point down) red triangle.[15]

In March 1935 According to Joseph Goebbels, the Soviet Union's recent inclusion in the League of Nations was engineered by 300 "members of the Jewish race and conspirators of Freemasonry."

On August 8, 1935, as Führer and Chancellor, Adolf Hitler announced in the Nazi Party newspaper, Voelkischer Beobachter, the final dissolution of all Masonic Lodges in Germany. The article accused a conspiracy of the Fraternity and “World Jewry” of seeking to create a “World Republic”.[16]

In 1937 Joseph Goebbels inaugurated an "Anti-Masonic Exposition" to display objects seized by the state.[12] The Ministry of Defence forbid officers from becoming Freemasons, with officers who remained as Masons being sidelined.[1] Field-Marshal Friedrich Paulus was denounced as a "High-grade Freemason" when he surrendered to the Soviet Union in 1943.[17]

Freemasonry was banned by edict in all countries that were either allied with the Nazis or under Nazi control, including Norway and France. Anti-Masonic exhibitions were held in many occupied countries.